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SSjin 3 Goku (Pre-Tail) vs. SSjin Vegetto
Topic Started: Oct 8 2012, 06:32 PM (1,297 Views)
+ supersaqer
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Transcendent

Who wins? Goku has an unlimited time in SSjin 3.
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Paikuan extreme
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Not just unlimited but all it entails.

Goku was already ssj3 but his tail put him at his absolute max, plus unlimited ki. Thats how he knew for sure that ssj3 was useless against baby. He was just too strong, it was fusion.

But it doesnt matter, SSj2 goku by this time could handle vegetto.

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+ Pyrus
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Goku didn't get any stronger from having his tail pulled back out. This was stated by Baby and Goku reluctantly agreed after he realized he wasn't doing any better than before.

SSjin Vegetto > SSjin 3 Goku still stands.
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Paikuan extreme
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nah, elder kai did it to release ssj4 not make him a master of a form he ALREADy mastered.

it extended his ki output, which extends him to his ultimate max. Its called STAMINA.

The tail was for ssj4 as he had already mastered SSj3. As was proven later....

proving once again that gokus power is too much for his body, so he transforms.
Edited by Paikuan extreme, Oct 8 2012, 06:52 PM.
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Paikuan extreme
Oct 8 2012, 06:51 PM
nah, elder kai did it to release ssj4 not make him a master of a form he ALREADy mastered.

it extended his ki output, which extends him to his ultimate max. Its called STAMINA.

The tail was for ssj4 as he had already mastered SSj3. As was proven later....

proving once again that gokus power is too much for his body, so he transforms.
His tail was pulled out to hopefully release his dormant power, which they thought would happen in Super Saiyan 3, but didn't. His stamina may have been greater, but his strength wasn't any different.
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Paikuan extreme
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His bodys abililty to handle what his true strength was is calledi nto question, therefore, the new transformation. THAT was gokus dormant power. SSj3 just wasnt enough. Goku knew it. He even said so after realizing he wasnt getting anywhere.

Elder kai wouldnt have said so if thats not what he meant, both japanese and english dubs have mentioned elder kai hoping to release SSj4. He didnt even tell goku what he was doing. GOKU thought it would make him stronger.

IE: having infinite stamina makes you stronger.
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I'm confused. Was Elder Kaioshin hoping Goku would transform to Super Saiyan 4 when his tail was pulled out, or did he think Goku's power would just be released within Super Saiyan 3?
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I'm pretty sure he expected it to happen in SSJ3, because he had no idea what the Golden Oozaru was (though he did know what the SSJ4 was, oddly).
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Paikuan extreme
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see the contradiction? he knew about ssj4 and was hoping it would come to pass. Extending ssj3 was a short term plan.

Goku thought it was only for ssj3 because thats all elder kai told him.

No explanation for the golden oozaru, although a wild guess would be an ozzaru that was in ssj. It would be all i would think, a saiyan who is at the true limit of their power all the way to monster form. Elder kai gambled and hoped goku would keep his sanity, cause he knew what would happen when goku got his reason, he would transform.

baby did it so easy with vegeta cause vegeta is a truly elite and trained soldier in the art of saiyan combat. Vegeta and nappa were bragged to be one of the few that could control their oozaru forms, although it wasnt limited to them, as in the original bardock movie, bardock and his crew had no issues going wild with oozaru, those guys were a well oiled team. Not a bunch of monsters.
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+ miguelnuva
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Vegito wins. Goku in SSJ3 couldn't handle Baby Vegeta 1st form who is stronger than MSSJ Vegito but not by much.

I think Goku would have said stronger than me instead of strongest ki ever if he was on Vegito's level at that point.

Also I believe you need the tail to master both SSJ3 and transform to SSJ4.
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Paikuan extreme
Oct 8 2012, 09:33 PM
see the contradiction? he knew about ssj4 and was hoping it would come to pass. Extending ssj3 was a short term plan.

Goku thought it was only for ssj3 because thats all elder kai told him.

No explanation for the golden oozaru, although a wild guess would be an ozzaru that was in ssj. It would be all i would think, a saiyan who is at the true limit of their power all the way to monster form. Elder kai gambled and hoped goku would keep his sanity, cause he knew what would happen when goku got his reason, he would transform.

baby did it so easy with vegeta cause vegeta is a truly elite and trained soldier in the art of saiyan combat. Vegeta and nappa were bragged to be one of the few that could control their oozaru forms, although it wasnt limited to them, as in the original bardock movie, bardock and his crew had no issues going wild with oozaru, those guys were a well oiled team. Not a bunch of monsters.
They didn't have their memory after regressing like Vegeta and Nappa, though. That's one thing that separated Bardock's team from the trained elites.
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Paikuan extreme
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i did not perceive that. All i saw was them partying for a mission well done.
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Saberoph
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Lest's see...Goku without his tail vs MSS Vegetto, well...

1. MSS Vegetto wasn't surpassed until Baby Vegeta Transformed.
2. Despite what the title says, Goku couldn't sustain SS3 hardly any without his Tail as a Kid.
3. Even if this was Adult SS3 Goku it wouldn't make a difference.
4. Goku becoming a Kid Did NOT make him weaker.
5. Goku and Baby BOTH say Goku's power Did NOT increase after getting his Tail.
6. Goku did NOT start gaining power Until he Transformed into the Super Great Ape.

I really don't know why these facts are so hard to understand when they are not contradicted.
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SSJ
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I think Vegito will most definitely take this one.
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+ miguelnuva
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Saberoph
Oct 11 2012, 01:13 AM
Lest's see...Goku without his tail vs MSS Vegetto, well...

1. MSS Vegetto wasn't surpassed until Baby Vegeta Transformed.
2. Despite what the title says, Goku couldn't sustain SS3 hardly any without his Tail as a Kid.
3. Even if this was Adult SS3 Goku it wouldn't make a difference.
4. Goku becoming a Kid Did NOT make him weaker.
5. Goku and Baby BOTH say Goku's power Did NOT increase after getting his Tail.
6. Goku did NOT start gaining power Until he Transformed into the Super Great Ape.

I really don't know why these facts are so hard to understand when they are not contradicted.
I have Baby Vegeta in his base form a tiny ahead of Vegito, Goku says his power is Ferocious when he powers up.
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